The Grudge (WARNING: 26 years to #6?)

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by hellboy » Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:24 am

Yep, nailed it. Minus the drum solo

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by snazzlefrass » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:48 am

IDK what y'all are bitchin' about, I paid 200 for two tix next to Junior.

I'm just going so I can blow kisses and winks at him. Fuck Tool. Will probably wear industrial noise canceling muffs.
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by KamikazeShaman37 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:57 am

Calfium Jay wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:06 pm
Thirteen years and what do we get? Six songs that show pretty much zilch in the way of progression or artistic development. No risks taken. Cookie cutter Tool songs knocked out to appease the die hards, straight from an over cooked, over used template. Oh...and a drum solo.

Thanks guys.
Question for you. Can you articulate what they might have done differently with the music? Not being a dick, but really, what were you thinking they would do?

I can understand exactly what you mean though and your description makes sense from that perspective, but overall I’m a happy camper with what they did.

It’s Tool being Tool. But to me it has evolved into a progression of their style that is similar/pays tribute to previous work, but even more musically sophisticated and challenging (even to them).

Another question for you. Do you think they are happy with it?

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by snazzlefrass » Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:56 pm

KamikazeShaman37 wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:57 am
Calfium Jay wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:06 pm
Thirteen years and what do we get? Six songs that show pretty much zilch in the way of progression or artistic development. No risks taken. Cookie cutter Tool songs knocked out to appease the die hards, straight from an over cooked, over used template. Oh...and a drum solo.

Thanks guys.
Question for you. Can you articulate what they might have done differently with the music? Not being a dick, but really, what were you thinking they would do?

I can understand exactly what you mean though and your description makes sense from that perspective, but overall I’m a happy camper with what they did.

It’s Tool being Tool. But to me it has evolved into a progression of their style that is similar/pays tribute to previous work, but even more musically sophisticated and challenging (even to them).

Another question for you. Do you think they are happy with it?
You’re doing it wrong. This is The Grudge. You see Russ, here at The Grudge we like to shit on all things Tool. So either shit or get off The Pot. Heh.
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Calfium Jay » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:53 pm

tys0n wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:14 pm

Kind of like Godflesh yeah?

Because you've given them more than a cursory listen?
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Calfium Jay » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:54 pm



What he said.
People like me just want to watch the world burn.

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Calfium Jay » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:00 pm

KamikazeShaman37 wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:57 am

Question for you. Can you articulate what they might have done differently with the music? Not being a dick, but really, what were you thinking they would do?

For a band that spent a dozen year yapping on and on and on about how they were taking their time so as to "push boundaries" and "not repeat ourselves..."

The question must be asked...

WHAT FUCKING BOUNDARIES DO YOU THINK YOU'VE PUSHED WITH THIS NEW MATERIAL AND WHAT THE HELL MAKES YOU THINK YA HAVEN'T REPEATED YOURSELVES???

This new material is about as cookie cutter Tool as it could possibly get - right down to riffs that are blatantly lifted from past albums.

You can see where these songs are going right from the get go. There are literally NO surprises to found. NO interesting twists and turns. Nothing new. Nothing innovative. Nothing that breaks convention with what they've been doing all along.

Nothing.

Another question for you. Do you think they are happy with it?
Like I care.


:|
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by tys0n » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:05 pm

Calfium Jay wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:53 pm
tys0n wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:14 pm

Kind of like Godflesh yeah?

Because you've given them more than a cursory listen?
How would THAT change anything?

A fact is a fact.
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by purplepanther777 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:44 pm

"WHAT FUCKING BOUNDARIES DO YOU THINK YOU'VE PUSHED WITH THIS NEW MATERIAL AND WHAT THE HELL MAKES YOU THINK YA HAVEN'T REPEATED YOURSELVES???"

First of all LOL Second... The age barrier for one. They just made the best geriatric rock album in history. They also pushed their own boundaries of technical musicianship, application of will, their own fears and insecurities, etc.

Yes, they have repeated themselves stylistically a bit more than they did between Undertow, Aenima, and Lateralus. But they are older men... they have already been through their process of artistic identity development and all that crap. They are on to pushing different kinds of boundaries than they did back then. And this album is the result. Honestly I don't understand all the complaining that it sounds like their own stuff and so it sucks. It sounds very fucking distinct to me after hearing it dozens of times. And as with all Tool albums it has a subliminal layer of life that can take years to explore.

If you're able to push beyond your own judgmental boundaries you might get to hear the new Tool album lol (nothin personal, I just had to say that in order to keep with the grudge theme)

EDIT: also I should admit I've had my own moments of thinking the album might actually suck lol

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Calfium Jay » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:58 pm

Never Forget Sex
Utopia Dust
Chickenhawk
(1) Spoons
At Ends
There Is One True Religion
Street. Guidance
A Turning Point
Your Shit Skin Color
People like me just want to watch the world burn.

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by children » Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:46 am

People are arrogant to think they are intelligent enough to comprehend this album on just one or two or even a handful of listens. Not even listening to this thing constantly will make you like it necessarily. It takes actual time to go by before it really can take root in your brain.

Repeated listens can speed up the process, but I am just beginning to really have the complex layers of this record unfold in my soul after listening to this thing as much as possible.

Music listeners used to be limited by what they physically possessed so they would re-listen to records all the time. Sometimes there would be a record you thought wasn't good but would keep listening just because it's all you had.

Over time you might even forget that you didn't like it at first and it becomes a classic in your mind because it's had a good long time to marinate in the psyche and rub it's majestic grooves deep into the collective consciousness.

I mean who doesn't love 10,000 Days by now? That is a gorgeous album. I don't take a music listener's opinion seriously if they dislike that album. Hey we all got opinions..
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by bob » Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:53 am

Califum has some good points i think. in short my first thoughts were, they are more into tech pushing their limits then they are writing a cohesive song. 10k was the start of that and this is the more realized version. at least FI is a full album while 10k felt like half an album. Rosetta and Jambi are the gold from that one imo.

Adam to me is pretty innovative on this one. hes doing stuff hes never done before and his sound is cleaner and that layered guitar part he does in Descending is freakin beautiful and dances across the rest of the music during that part. his obsessiveness paid off!

Dannys been doing more fills and over drumming i guess we can call it ? live since 2012 that i remember. he plays just like that on the new album which he also does in older songs if you listen to boots the last bunch of tours. dudes amazing but just saying its not anything i havent heard him do which is fine but not innovative. same goes for Justin..hes amazing but hes not doing anything diff. Adam wins for innovation.

ya its ''the grudge'' i dont hate the album but im not blown away by it. dare i say it still feels a little short only cause its so little songs yet its a lot of music at the same time if that makes sense

piss on ya'll !!! :)

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by hellboy » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:38 am

Let's face it, just like bald edgy guy, Califum was never going to post a positive review. It would completely undo all the hard work he's put into this forum over the years.

It's easy to come to the conclusion that since the songs sound like Tool, and progress like Tool, that they haven't pushed themselves. If that's the biggest criticism, then I'd suggest the reviewer is also not really "pushing themselves"

Tool certainly are guilty of writing a Tool album. For that alone, fuck 'em I guess.

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by ziggy23 » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:41 am

Image
- You like noisy music?
- Yes. The louder the better. Stops me from thinking.
- You don't like to think? What do you like?
- Never thought about it.

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Calfium Jay » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:50 am

hellboy wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:38 am
Let's face it, just like bald edgy guy, Califum was never going to post a positive review. It would completely undo all the hard work he's put into this forum over the years.

Look, I know what you're thinking. And you're right. I hate doing this and I hate having to front up here.

It was long. No doubt. 70 minutes and more even. We stuck through and ended up naked.

There was only one that we hated. I hated it anyway. And you can laugh as much as you want and flick your hair back in disapproval, but make no mistake:

This is not what we were ready for.

Most people here have agreed at some point. There's no point chugging away at riffs when you're only going to end up at the 11 minute mark, out of breath, lacking anything remotely original and back where you started. It's been done so many times and you can hardly blame a guy for wanting more.

:lol:

No, no. It's not. It's not. It's like the old story goes - the enemy of my enemy is my friend. And none of these tracks end up being my friend. Although you couldn't argue that it's not for lack of trying.

So I'm giving this album a def.
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Calfium Jay » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:51 am

So yeah, it's going to be a long night...
People like me just want to watch the world burn.

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Boldizar » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:52 am

All credibility was lost upon the sharing of that Fantano review.

Tool has proven that near 60 year olds can still capture the creative lightning that bands often only find in their 20-30s, as they did. They took time and crafted something just as good as Lateralus and Aenima.

Fuck it, sounds like Tool and the segues suck. Should have just released static noises with crickets chirping. PUSHING THE BOUNDARIES!!!
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by tys0n » Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:55 am

It might be Cal's true opinion but who knows and who cares.

He gave it, his loss imo, time to move on.

Let him find something else to enjoy while he wastes his inheritance on thousand dollar handbags for his Brazilian model fiancée that''s with him for his personality.
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Takeo » Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:09 am

I don’t agree that this record sounds like Tool. Stylistically, the songs are missing vocals, direction, momentum, punch, climax, and release. That’s not Tool. I’ve gone back to it several times, but while it sounds good with plenty of supposed “complexities,” it’s not resonating. No songs here hold up to the highlights from previous albums.

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by hellboy » Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:28 am

No shortage of vocals, direction, momentum, punch, climax and release on what I listen to. Did you download the Taylor Swift album instead?

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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by snazzlefrass » Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:54 am

Burn!

Staying ON topic, where’s the next new album? I want moar fuckers, moar!!!!!
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by Boldizar » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:26 pm

Tool should have done an acoustic album! Hacks!!
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by children » Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:46 pm

People who are saying this album isn't pushing any boundaries are either stupid or willfully ignorant.

It's ok to not like the album or for it to not be what you are into (although, you clearly are listening to the wrong band to begin with because you are just not into psychedelic music) but objectively the musicianship and production and even the artwork and lyrical concept is pushing every boundary imaginable.

I don't like Dream Theater's music but I can objectively acknowledge that they push the technical boundaries of prog rock and each member has an incredible amount of talent. They just don't apply those skills into making music that has any sort of emotional or spiritual reaction; it only penetrates as far as the intellect, and if that's as deep as you are capable of reaching as a human, then there's not much you can do about it, I suppose.

Tool on the other hand are operating on an entirely different level, where intellectual analysis actually hinders the perception of the music. You can only truly access the space they are exploring by being an empathetic and spiritual person to begin with.

Non-spiritual people hear Maynard talking about us being spirits attached to flesh and it goes against what they believe which is probably strictly only anything that is considered scientific, so they are turned off immediately.

I don't trust people who are not humble enough to be open to the idea that there is more to this existence than than this physical reality...
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by tys0n » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:01 pm

Where the FUCK is my pinball machine!
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Re: The Grudge (WARNING: It Hapenned!!)

Post by GabesCaves » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:52 pm

Takeo wrote:
Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:09 am
I don’t agree that this record sounds like Tool. Stylistically, the songs are missing vocals, direction, momentum, punch, climax, and release. That’s not Tool. I’ve gone back to it several times, but while it sounds good with plenty of supposed “complexities,” it’s not resonating. No songs here hold up to the highlights from previous albums.

I agree that FI is certainly missing an important strength of Tool, but I disagree that it doesn't sound like them. It does but with one important characteristic missing.

I also disagree in that I think this is a terrific album. It's just that the other 4 are better.

What is missing is Maynard's soaring melodies. His melody provides essential balance to probably the best rhythm section in the history of rock.

Historically, Maynards melodic singing provides balance to their intense and complex rhythms. It provides emphasis on their insanely tasteful tempo changes. This dynamic on FI is just not up to the standards they have set on the prior records.

The musicianship and complexly pounding rhythm is insanely intense and compelling on FI. But it alone is just not enough to compete with...them.

Culling and Pneuma are my favorites here because they come closest to competing with their catalog melodically. 7empest is the best example of a song that is incredible...but is very much not a balanced song. Incredible rhythm. Incredible riffage. But Tools back albums easily have more musical balance to offer.

On Jambi, Maynards soaring melodic vocal above the insanely excellent rhythm:

" ...So if I could I'd wish it all away
If I thought tomorrow would take you away
You're my peace of mind, my home, my center
I'm just trying to hold on
One more day
"
Not to mention Maynards incredible emotive vocal after that incredible solo...

"Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent sun

Shine on upon the broken
Shine until the two become one
Shine on forever
Shine on benevolent sun..."

These melodic interludes provides perspective for the intense rhythm that closes out Jambi, by providing incredible balance.

That's an example of something that just isn't part of FI.

What song on FI breaks into the top three songs on any of the other albums that most fans would agree to?


tl,dr: Maynard's role within the bands dynamic has been modified leaving their melodic balance lacking in comparison to their back catalog.

Sry too long. Yawn. Noone is innocent.

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