F O U R T H E Y E

Not Tyson wrote:Well it is an ode to may may's dead mother

Yes, I know this. And he did a bang-up job bringing the overall feeling of mourning. That's what I was saying, whoever you are!

Well I'm not Tyson, that's for sure

This much is clear.

I've never dressed-up alcohol abuse to be a positive, life-changing activity.

And the fact that I am capable of forming coherent sentences while bombed, unlike your druggo hippie up there, should stand for something, too.

I love how listening to TOOL while fucked up on drugs is supposed to be this ecstatic, mind-blowing experience. Try that with any band you're into. You'll probably realise it's the drugs, not the band.

Aaaaaaand yet again, I'm in an argument with children. How does he do it? I must be brain-damaged from the booze, you're right.

It's easy to get in to arguements with children.

Sticky little bastards

Both Mog and Children are trolls in the most common sense of the word, they are polar opposites yet serve the same purpose.

It's strange to be a part of a forum where I'm no longer a protagonist, more of a whipping boy.

Feels good.

Entertainment is entertainment, neither Mog or Children entertain.

The Boss wrote:I've never dressed-up alcohol abuse to be a positive, life-changing activity.

And the fact that I am capable of forming coherent sentences while bombed, unlike your druggo hippie up there, should stand for something, too.

I love how listening to TOOL while fucked up on drugs is supposed to be this ecstatic, mind-blowing experience. Try that with any band you're into. You'll probably realise it's the drugs, not the band.

Aaaaaaand yet again, I'm in an argument with children. How does he do it? I must be brain-damaged from the booze, you're right.

Are you being serious right now with this anti-drug shit? You do drugs all the time, motherfucker. Alcohol is a drug; do not deny it.

Taking shrooms is probably one of the most enjoyable experiences you can have in life and it has expanded my consciousness immensely. It doesn't matter whether you listen to music or not; they are going to be mind-blowing. Listening to TOOL sober is mind-blowing enough as it is, but mushrooms takes it to a new level entirely.

Using hallucinogens gives you a completely different perspective; not just on music, but on ideas and concepts. It literally changes the way you think. I honestly, and deeply believe that a person cannot truly become their own being and step out of their ego without taking some kind of mind-altering substance in order to let themselves see the world in a new light and give themselves a chance to see another side of reality.

This all really makes a whole lotta sense, though. You haven't tripped, have you, Crow? Or, possibly, you did trip and you did not have a good one, and then, maybe you had some sort of a nervous breakdown, or mental breakdown, or even an emotional breakdown and that's when you turned to alcohol to drown all of your sorrows with liquid shame and sink into oblivion...

the words "full Tool mode right now" gave me a woody.

children wrote:

The Boss wrote:I've never dressed-up alcohol abuse to be a positive, life-changing activity.

And the fact that I am capable of forming coherent sentences while bombed, unlike your druggo hippie up there, should stand for something, too.

I love how listening to TOOL while fucked up on drugs is supposed to be this ecstatic, mind-blowing experience. Try that with any band you're into. You'll probably realise it's the drugs, not the band.

Aaaaaaand yet again, I'm in an argument with children. How does he do it? I must be brain-damaged from the booze, you're right.

Are you being serious right now with this anti-drug shit? You do drugs all the time, motherfucker. Alcohol is a drug; do not deny it.

Taking shrooms is probably one of the most enjoyable experiences you can have in life and it has expanded my consciousness immensely. It doesn't matter whether you listen to music or not; they are going to be mind-blowing. Listening to TOOL sober is mind-blowing enough as it is, but mushrooms takes it to a new level entirely.

Using hallucinogens gives you a completely different perspective; not just on music, but on ideas and concepts. It literally changes the way you think. I honestly, and deeply believe that a person cannot truly become their own being and step out of their ego without taking some kind of mind-altering substance in order to let themselves see the world in a new light and give themselves a chance to see another side of reality.

This all really makes a whole lotta sense, though. You haven't tripped, have you, Crow? Or, possibly, you did trip and you did not have a good one, and then, maybe you had some sort of a nervous breakdown, or mental breakdown, or even an emotional breakdown and that's when you turned to alcohol to drown all of your sorrows with liquid shame and sink into oblivion...

Please don't pretend you know me. You're embarrassing yourself.

How can i know you, when you don't even seem to know yourself? I don't think i am the only one pretending here...

stalker mode engaged.

N.Y.H.C. wrote:the words "full Tool mode right now" gave me a woody.

Would you say it put you in, Full Tool Mode(tm)?

children wrote:

The Boss wrote:I've never dressed-up alcohol abuse to be a positive, life-changing activity.

And the fact that I am capable of forming coherent sentences while bombed, unlike your druggo hippie up there, should stand for something, too.

I love how listening to TOOL while fucked up on drugs is supposed to be this ecstatic, mind-blowing experience. Try that with any band you're into. You'll probably realise it's the drugs, not the band.

Aaaaaaand yet again, I'm in an argument with children. How does he do it? I must be brain-damaged from the booze, you're right.

Are you being serious right now with this anti-drug shit? You do drugs all the time, motherfucker. Alcohol is a drug; do not deny it.

Taking shrooms is probably one of the most enjoyable experiences you can have in life and it has expanded my consciousness immensely. It doesn't matter whether you listen to music or not; they are going to be mind-blowing. Listening to TOOL sober is mind-blowing enough as it is, but mushrooms takes it to a new level entirely.

Using hallucinogens gives you a completely different perspective; not just on music, but on ideas and concepts. It literally changes the way you think. I honestly, and deeply believe that a person cannot truly become their own being and step out of their ego without taking some kind of mind-altering substance in order to let themselves see the world in a new light and give themselves a chance to see another side of reality.

This all really makes a whole lotta sense, though. You haven't tripped, have you, Crow? Or, possibly, you did trip and you did not have a good one, and then, maybe you had some sort of a nervous breakdown, or mental breakdown, or even an emotional breakdown and that's when you turned to alcohol to drown all of your sorrows with liquid shame and sink into oblivion...

bwhahahahahaaha!

I have tripped many times. It didn't expand shit. It got me high. I saw trails, I laughed, tingled a bit, listened to good music and watched shit with quality visuals. You know what LSD taught me? Absolutely nothing. This spiritual enlightenment bullshit is a cop out. Look I have no problem with people wanting to get high using whatever substance they prefer. Just don't pull some religious experience bullshit. You do drugs because you like the way they make you feel. Really fucking simple.

Oh and you don't need drugs to expand your mind. I guarantee you will learn more from studying Quantum Physics or Philosophy than you will from taking any drug.

MOG wrote:

children wrote:

The Boss wrote:I've never dressed-up alcohol abuse to be a positive, life-changing activity.

And the fact that I am capable of forming coherent sentences while bombed, unlike your druggo hippie up there, should stand for something, too.

I love how listening to TOOL while fucked up on drugs is supposed to be this ecstatic, mind-blowing experience. Try that with any band you're into. You'll probably realise it's the drugs, not the band.

Aaaaaaand yet again, I'm in an argument with children. How does he do it? I must be brain-damaged from the booze, you're right.

Are you being serious right now with this anti-drug shit? You do drugs all the time, motherfucker. Alcohol is a drug; do not deny it.

Taking shrooms is probably one of the most enjoyable experiences you can have in life and it has expanded my consciousness immensely. It doesn't matter whether you listen to music or not; they are going to be mind-blowing. Listening to TOOL sober is mind-blowing enough as it is, but mushrooms takes it to a new level entirely.

Using hallucinogens gives you a completely different perspective; not just on music, but on ideas and concepts. It literally changes the way you think. I honestly, and deeply believe that a person cannot truly become their own being and step out of their ego without taking some kind of mind-altering substance in order to let themselves see the world in a new light and give themselves a chance to see another side of reality.

This all really makes a whole lotta sense, though. You haven't tripped, have you, Crow? Or, possibly, you did trip and you did not have a good one, and then, maybe you had some sort of a nervous breakdown, or mental breakdown, or even an emotional breakdown and that's when you turned to alcohol to drown all of your sorrows with liquid shame and sink into oblivion...

bwhahahahahaaha!

I have tripped many times. It didn't expand shit. It got me high. I saw trails, I laughed, tingled a bit, listened to good music and watched shit with quality visuals. You know what LSD taught me? Absolutely nothing. This spiritual enlightenment bullshit is a cop out. Look I have no problem with people wanting to get high using whatever substance they prefer. Just don't pull some religious experience bullshit. You do drugs because you like the way they make you feel. Really fucking simple.

Oh and you don't need drugs to expand your mind. I guarantee you will learn more from studying Quantum Physics or Philosophy than you will from taking any drug.

It's about intention. If you go into a powerful trip with the mindset of allowing yourself to have a spiritual experience it increases your chances. Going on a hike or something, probably by yourself, also helps. Some people trip with friends, and that's fine, but you won't have any type of spiritual experience. If you don't believe in the spirit then you won't have one either.

Not Tyson wrote:Allphones, it was pretty crisp just wasn't LOUD

Or maybe I'm going deaf.

Where were you standing/sitting? If you're too close to the stage the acoustics suck. I feel bad for the die-hard Tool fans that go to their first show and they want to be right up against the rail. That's literally the worst place in the house. 20 yards back, right in the middle.... that's when it rings your ears for a couple of days.

inspiration_tactic wrote: It's about intention. If you go into a powerful with the mindset of allowing yourself to have a spiritual experience it increases your chances. Going on a hike or something, probably by yourself, also helps. Some people trip with friends, and that's fine, but you won't have any type of spiritual experience. If you don't believe in the spirit then you won't have one either.

Whatever works for you but it is a bunch of bullshit imo. People come up with the most delusional excuses to get high. Just say you like getting high and move on. Anything "spiritual" you think you are feeling are random Synapses firing in your brain. Fuck I hope the study of Neuroscience becomes a requirement in schools at some point. Might help to curb all this mumbo jumbo pseudo spiritual bible thumping bullshit that is so prevalent at the moment if people actually had a basic, functional working knowledge of how their brains actually work.

MOG wrote:

inspiration_tactic wrote: It's about intention. If you go into a powerful with the mindset of allowing yourself to have a spiritual experience it increases your chances. Going on a hike or something, probably by yourself, also helps. Some people trip with friends, and that's fine, but you won't have any type of spiritual experience. If you don't believe in the spirit then you won't have one either.

Whatever works for you but it is a bunch of bullshit imo. People come up with the most delusional excuses to get high. Just say you like getting high and move on. Anything "spiritual" you think you are feeling are random Synapses firing in your brain. Fuck I hope the study of Neuroscience becomes a requirement in schools at some point. Might help to curb all this mumbo jumbo pseudo spiritual bible thumping bullshit that is so prevalent at the moment if people actually had a basic, functional working knowledge of how their brains actually work.

Typically I'd agree with you. I've done my research on DMT (read The Spirit Molecule) like I'm sure a few of you have. I've also read "The God Particle" by Leon Lederman which is about quantum physics and the previously theoretical, newly discovered Higgs-Boson Particle. I think there is more to the pineal gland and it's relation to quantum physics than meets the eye. There is actually quite a bit of weight supporting the 'out of body' experience as something that may be more than just 'getting high'... if you believe that there are multiple dimensions like Mr. Lederman and Mr. Rick Strassman (two men who are much smarter than you or I) then it is feasible that taking certain substances can help us to perceive such boundaries. Strassman's take was that we're just tuning our perception frequency to a different radio station when we take DMT, so to speak. Anyway, don't be too dismissive. It's all very interesting, at the very least.

Definitely don't misconstrue spirituality and mind-expansion with 'bible-thumping'... I'd be the last person to do that.

haha mog somehow missed that reoccuring theme in tools music?

inspiration_tactic wrote:If you're too close to the stage the acoustics suck. I feel bad for the die-hard Tool fans that go to their first show and they want to be right up against the rail. That's literally the worst place in the house. 20 yards back, right in the middle.... that's when it rings your ears for a couple of days.

That completely depends on the band/stage setup. For bands that only use standard monitors, you are getting a skewed mix depending on whose monitors you are closest too. And they are usually warring with each other making it even worse. In that scenario, I agree with you.

However, for bands using in-ear monitors (most major acts), that doesn't really apply.

When I'm lucky enough to see a band I love two nights in a row at the same venue, I usually make a point of hitting one night as close as possible on the floor, and the next in a sweet seat, hopefully close to the sound board. Best of both worlds for sound (usually) and visuals. Some notable gigs for that experience were Tool @ The Palms in Vegas, APC at their Fillmore SF run, Smashing Pumpkins at their Fillmore SF residency and Soundgarden @ The Fox in Oakland.

mcnadd wrote:haha mog somehow missed that reoccuring theme in tools music?

Huh? Enlightenment via Hallucinogens is a re-occurring theme in Tool's music? Wow you TTFers take your Tool shit wayyyy too seriously. It's just rock music. I promise it won't change your life, walk your dog, fuck your wife or induce spiritual enlightenment.

MOG wrote:

inspiration_tactic wrote: It's about intention. If you go into a powerful with the mindset of allowing yourself to have a spiritual experience it increases your chances. Going on a hike or something, probably by yourself, also helps. Some people trip with friends, and that's fine, but you won't have any type of spiritual experience. If you don't believe in the spirit then you won't have one either.

Whatever works for you but it is a bunch of bullshit imo. People come up with the most delusional excuses to get high. Just say you like getting high and move on. Anything "spiritual" you think you are feeling are random Synapses firing in your brain. Fuck I hope the study of Neuroscience becomes a requirement in schools at some point. Might help to curb all this mumbo jumbo pseudo spiritual bible thumping bullshit that is so prevalent at the moment if people actually had a basic, functional working knowledge of how their brains actually work.

Mog honey, as much as I think I love you..r Internet persona.. I want to put it out there now, that this (for ME!) is ultimately a matter of gauging. Or perception. Maybe even (gasp!) good or EVIL. For some. Or semantics. Whichever in (hell) this World You* choose to place it.

I'm well aware how our minds interpret the effects of chemicals experienced in the body (ingested from external sources, or synthesized within). I'm also aware that 'spirituality' is viewed by many humans as an ill-informed tradition, lacking 'super rationality', essentially prehistoric to how far we've advanced with our scientific understanding of our own being..

Now I am not going to jump much further down this hole (or up the mountain, whichever you identify with..). Maybe spew out what I originally intended to say! Already!

Regardless of what state a mind a person interprets a situation, usually 'synapses' have been formed prior, reinforcing those ideas, and an 'interpretation' is somewhat narrowed down, or expected. If a person steps into a situation with a 'spiritual' intention, or perhaps just a 'spiritual' frame of mind, they're going to expect, or 'foresee', something profound to their understanding of said situation.

Afterwards a person 'assimilates' this experience into the fold, making sense of it how they know to, because the synapses in their mind shape their 'view' of the 'world'. And, here it is, 'we' as a living creature self-reference ALL information we receive. Usually as 'true'.

Now, I'm going to stop, because this goes on ad infintium. And I'm apparently getting nowhere.

All i originally, at the simplistic (*beginning) of my response here, all I wanted to say was

If a person goes in with a spiritual mind, subconsciously 'expecting' something profound, they will probably experience.

ON THE OTHER HAND.

If a person goes with a purely analytic, 'reasoning', 'scientific' mind, they will find an 'Absolute' ground for their 'pure-reasoned', A-B thought process.


EVERYTHING IS SUBJECTIVE

I'm tired, I apologize. But at this point I don't care to finish.

Never an attack, just a conversation. With whoever involved

If you believe it - then it is real - at least to you - and that is subjective - so what is real - whatever you believe.

I guess.

Then again maybe not.


Am I talking in circles? You BET-CHA

trilobite wrote:
If a person goes in with a spiritual mind, subconsciously 'expecting' something profound, they will probably experience.

ON THE OTHER HAND.

If a person goes with a purely analytic, 'reasoning', 'scientific' mind, they will find an 'Absolute' ground for their 'pure-reasoned', A-B thought process.


EVERYTHING IS SUBJECTIVE

Very true... one can experience a spiritual epiphany with aid from psychedelics or from meditation. I've never felt the 'we are all connected' thing like I did from one trip (out of probably 9 or 10, so it's not every time by any means). It was the atypical 'out of body' experience... but it can't really be understood with words. It's just a feeling... and it's one of assurance. Maybe Tool's music was a guiding force in the initial processes; maybe they provided a context or a preamble of sorts. By that rationale I guess Tool's music could take some credit, however minimal, for getting the ball rolling--thus 'changing your life'...
Speaking from my own experience, I wouldn't be near the outside the box, free-thinker that I am without those guys. I do give them some credit. For some people out there, they did obtain some type of enlightenment from the band. So there you are wrong MOG.

trilobite wrote: Mog honey, as much as I think I love you..r Internet persona..

^ Oh come on you can't just get me all excited and not let me finish. That's wrong. Here I thought I was getting some love and then I see it's just that bastard MOG again. If you are gonna start jerkin me off it is only courtesy to let me finish.